Hi Leslie
I started out jotting down a few of my personal observations and beliefs about Chaplains and then asked for input from my colleagues. Now I think I have written a pronunciamento (Ed note: a pronunciamento is a formal announcement or declaration)
To keep this as objective as possible I thought it important to inform you of my background.
Raised a Catholic I am now at best agnostic... more likely atheist. I do like the idea of having a handy guide book for living an empathetic and compassionate life though - be it Bible, Qur'an, Torah, Bhagavdgita, Dhammapada or a Robert Fulghum novel.
My primary concern is that our State school is not secular. My concern is compounded by the government then selecting what religion they will put into our school. I strongly believe this act alone devalues other religions. What message does this send to my Muslim students and peers? My Hindu students and colleagues? Your beliefs are not valued? You are not valued?
The funding used for the Chaplaincy programme could be used to provide teacher aides to assist students with special needs in the classroom, or spent on closing the gap between indigenous and non-indigenous students. I have worked in a school where the indigenous liaison officer's office was a cupboard and where the indigenous office was on the far side of the oval. In contrast, the Chaplains' offices are always in prominent locations. Again, what message does this send our Aboriginal students and staff?
Liaison officers and teachers contribute countless hours to professional development and extra-curricular activities. While there are always exceptions to the rule, in my 14 years of teaching, I am not aware of a single Chaplain who has contributed any time to either PD or extra-curricular activites. Nor am I aware of a Chaplain completing a 4 year degree as we do. Yet, Chaplains are afforded all the priveleges of a teacher without the responsibilities.
These responsibilities include the Child Protection Policy. As a male teacher I am not permitted to sit with a female student one-on-one with the door closed to my office/room. I must keep the door open and must be in clear sight of other students or staff. School Chaplains do most of their 'counselling' one-on-one, out-of-sight and behind closed doors. This implies that while teachers cannot be trusted, those attached to a Christian church can be, despite the mounting number of sexual assaults on children perpetrated by the clergy.
Chaplains have 'recruited' students for their church at every school I have worked at. Recruiting can be as discreet as letting the students know there will be a rock band or fete on at their church, or as overt as handing out flyers inviting students to join their church.
The students who are attracted to the chaplaincy centre tend to be the special needs children. Also Autism Spectrum Disorder (ASD) kids who love getting biscuits and Milo in the morning.
I have asked other teachers at my school for any criticisms, recommendations, and/or commendations of the Chaplaincy Centre at our school. They have contributed the following:
- When students have emotional concerns and they want to discuss them they consult their favourite teacher. If not, they see the guidance officer (who is trained and secular). Very few, if any, consult the chaplain unless they want to 'skip' class;
- Trusting Chaplains in a closed environment is a concern for every teacher I consulted (8 in total);
Obviously, Chaplains have provided some much needed assistance to some students. But we contend this advice/support should have come from the guidance officer or a qualified counsellor, not a pseudo-trained Christian chaplain.
- Most teachers did not like that students could use the Chaplain as an excuse to 'dodge' classes - as compared to meeting with the guidance officer who is part of the school hierarchy and therefore accountable.
I was pleasantly surprised to learn how strongly other staff and admin are opposed to this programme.
Thank you for your interest. I admire not only what you do but the grace, dignity and intelligence with which you do it.
Kind Regards,
Paul Grealy
Thank you Paul for affording us an insight into the way the Chaplaincy program looks to teachers working in the state school system
My children will be attending a state school next year and reading this I believe a chaplaincy programme to be inappropriate. How much is this programme costing the government/tax payers?
ReplyDeleteHAH, awesome!
ReplyDeleteAnonymous2
ReplyDeletePaul's letter highlights all that is wrong with the almost exclusively-Christian chaplaincy program.
It is interesting that chaplains are, anecdotally in this school, the third line of counselling, even if most is in class time. That raises the question "what do they do" (besides evangelise)?
Well put Paul. I've discussed these same points with a couple of teacher friends and my teacher spouse, all of whom felt similarly.
ReplyDeleteThank you for publishing Paul's letter Leslie.
Lucas
I hope you're going to post from the other side as well. I know quite a few schools who have nothing but positive things to say about their chaplains. I am thinking about becoming one and am about to complete a BEd, and will then do a chaplaincy course. So 5 years training with kids. I intend to be part of extra-curricular activities and PDs, and will let kids know about the local church and youth group IF they ask.
ReplyDeleteNot every school is like the one you posted above. The chaplain at my school was fantastic. Kids who were bullied went to her (and later it was a guy) room as refuge during lunch times. Kids went to the guidance counsellor rarely, and usually for career guidance. When they wanted support, they went to the chaplain whose door remained OPEN.
Yet again, I want to scream - Has anyone asked the kids??! Yes, the teachers you asked *may* know a bit, but how much would they know about whether kids visit the chaplain during break times, or even during school time when their absence is unexplained? Do they really know how much the kids value the chaplain? There's a whole lot of adults weighing in, and not much listening to the actual consumers of the 'product'.
On a side note, I don't believe that you can argue chaplaincy should be removed because money could be better devoted to Indigenous causes at the school. You are absolutely right that it is clearly uneven (appallingly so), but there will always be that argument as there is never enough money for every need in the school. Instead of banning chaplaincy for that reason, how about arguing for more money for that cause AS WELL.
Also - just so you understand that I am not a religious nut - I do understand the argument about RE in schools and how that is unfair to other religions. We are a Christian country but obviously less people are following that religion now. So I understand if people want to get rid of RE - although you can just say that your kid isn't going to part of it. But I think chaplains are different and the rules surrounding them mean that they can actually be of more support to kids than guidance counsellors because of red tape and legalistic rules. We desperately need them in schools, and you WILL see schools and kids suffer if they are removed. I guess that's hard to understand if you don't believe in God, but the power of prayer and having a chaplain at the school shouldn't be underestimated in its ability to protect and bless your kids.
Some common issues from all the other reading I've done, and talking with those who have Chaplains.
ReplyDeleteElevated status from the school hierarchy.
Bribing kids with food, etc, and other "try-hard" to be liked strategies....
Recruiting for the Church (this is their OVERT purpose in any case)
Providing "counselling" usually without training
NO accountability, NO oversight, NO record keeping (?)
Targeting vulnerable students
Students using the Chaplain to get out of class.
The Program would be a joke, if the Mental Health of our young people wasn't so serious.
Use the money to employ School Psychologists (and other Special needs support!). There's $165 M saved right away - just for "ADMIN and INFRASTRUCTURE" that the Evangelicals are using to generate spin, publicity and lobbying.
What's hard for me to understand Just Some Thoughts is the unbelievable arrogance of someone who believes they have a right to tell me what is going to benefit and protect my kids. If the tables were turned, and I had the audacity to tell him that what he was offering his kids was in fact bogus rubbish, he would be justifiably offended, Which is why I would never do that, and never will. I show respect for the beliefs of others, whatever I think of them, and demand only that they aren't imposed on me or mine. This principle is what the secular state and school system is meant to be all about.
ReplyDeleteNo, it's NOT oK to break the tradition and promise of a secular school system on the grounds - seemingly, - that Christian people's views have a special status which allows them to know best for the rest of us, religious and non alike. Leaving people like me, as it happens, with nowhere to send our children free from the imposition of your faith.
It's is arrogant, and immoral in my view to behave like this because I don't believe what you believe, which is my right. And it is my right to raise my children free of your beliefs, too, no matter how good you think they are for them.
If I were you, I would hope that when secularity returns to australia those running things will stick to our principles and not display the arrogance that Christians are showing in this debate. Otherwise you will find yourself in the same pickle you and your lot have put parents like me - of minority faiths and no faith. Stripped of the religious freedom and our due rights as parents meant to be guaranteed to us by law and at the mercy of a tyrannical, arrogant minority.
There is much that is wrong with the National School Chaplaincy Program.
ReplyDeleteFirstly, as the letter points out, the majority opinion within a school environment selects the religion and denomination their school chaplain shall profess to believe in. The immediately maligns minority religions and denominations and completely alienates those with no religious belief at all.
The school then sets about locating someone of the “correct” religion. While the NSCP guidelines do allow secular staff to be hired, this can only be done after “every effort to hire a suitable chaplain has failed” (and by “suitable” read “religious”).
Once being hired on the basis of their professed belief in the supernatural, the guidelines then prohibit these religious people from acting religious. This is at odds with the publically stated mission goals of many of the employing organisations such as Scripture Union, ACCESS Ministries, and GenR8 who exist solely for the purpose of “spreading the good news of Jesus”.
So there we have it. A chaplain hired on the basis of their religion finds themselves in a public school with a slice of the $220 million dedicated to the program over the next three years. Since they have not been hired on the basis of their qualifications or experience, what are they meant to do? What CAN they do?
I haven’t even touched on chaplains overstepping their boundaries by providing counselling services, proselytising to children, or conducting religious instruction classes. These instances are rife within the chaplaincy service.
Our children deserve nothing less that the best care available, which means properly qualified people regardless of their personal religious beliefs. The NSCP must be scrapped immediately.
For more information, visit my blog at http://bit.ly/stopnscp and join our Facebook group – http://www.facebook.com/home.php?sk=group_161101063938816&ap=1
Just some thoughts... said... "We are a Christian Country".
ReplyDeleteNo, we are Not a theocracy.
Asking the kids has less merit the younger the kids, and even them is only going to produce anecdotal comments.
Saying "We desperately need them in schools, and you WILL see schools and kids suffer if they are removed" is hyperbole, and suggests you are more enamoured to religion than you state.
Dear “ Just Some Thoughts”,
ReplyDeleteI think your Evangelicals are showing...
”I am thinking about becoming one and am about to complete a BEd, and will then do a chaplaincy course. So 5 years training with kids”
Why would you do five years training and get a teaching qualification to then become a chaplain (which doesn't involve teaching?)...
”I intend to be part of extra-curricular activities and PDs, and will let kids know about the local church and youth group IF they ask.”
Ah, I see. Now you’re just scaring me.
”The chaplain at my school was fantastic. Kids who were bullied went to her (and later it was a guy) room as refuge during lunch times”
Hmm.. I'm not sure this is a very objective measure of your chaplain’s effectiveness? We have a place in our school called a library -- students can actually go there to read -- you know, books other than the Bible and religious propaganda. By the way -- students that are being bullied, will be followed up in our school by senior staff, and any support would be provided by our School Psychologist.
“but how much would they know about whether kids visit the chaplain during break times, or even during school time when their absence is unexplained?”
As you are about to complete five years of B Ed - let me explain to you a little thing called DUTY OF CARE.Teachers have to know where students are, during any time on school property.
How to spot a religious nut: (the Access ministries /Scripture union script):
” We are a Christian country”. Ah , no, no we’re not.
“....you WILL see schools and kids suffer if they are removed.”
HOW? They weren't even there are a few of years ago. but somehow, they are now "the glue that holds the school together" -- according to Scripture Union and Access Ministries
“Kids went to the guidance counsellor rarely, and usually for career guidance. When they wanted support, they went to the chaplain whose door remained OPEN.”
(By the way -- I'm not sure where you're from, but I don't know any guidance counsellor/school psychologist in Australia that spends much time - if any doing career guidance -- you may be thinking of America? This is nonsense. Maybe the door was closed because psychologists actually have to do this little thing called “confidentiality”, what with being a registered health professional and all, with a legally enforceable code of ethics.)
“But I think chaplains are different and the rules surrounding them mean that they can actually be of more support to kids than guidance counsellors because of red tape and legalistic rules.”
Yes, that's it -- just keep denigrating anyone with professional training -- and heck, we would want any sort of legalistic rules around people who have access to our children would we?
You are really frightening me. You put your foot in it, and I think you're about up to your knee by now.....
However, the coup de grace - at the end of the paragraph that started out with "just so you understand that I am not a religious nut", we have this:
“I guess that's hard to understand if you don't believe in God, but the power of prayer and having a chaplain at the school shouldn't be underestimated in its ability to protect and bless your kids.”
Please stay away from my children, Please stay out of our government schools. Please stop wasting our taxpayers money on this insidious evil.
There is a mental health crisis out there, and our young people need real help from trained professionals, who know what they're doing.
FFS, WE ARE NOT A CHRISTIAN COUNTRY! "Just some thoughts", you are precisely the problem we are trying to highlight here.
ReplyDeletePerfect. Couldn't have said it better myself Leslie.
ReplyDeleteWith all due respect, the comment of "we are a christian country" was not in relation to being a theocracy, but in reference to the foundation of this country... Please find below the beginning of the constitution of Australia to see what the original comment is referring to...
ReplyDeleteCOMMONWEALTH OF AUSTRALIA CONSTITUTION ACT
An Act to constitute the Commonwealth of Australia
[9th July 1900]
Whereas the people of New South Wales, Victoria, South Australia, Queensland, and Tasmania, humbly relying on the blessing of Almighty God, have agreed to unite in one indissoluble Federal Commonwealth under the Crown of the United Kingdom of Great Britain and Ireland, and under the Constitution hereby established:
Text copied from: http://australianpolitics.com/constitution-aus/text/preamble
The Commonwealth Ombudsman's recent report on the NSCP criticised just about every aspect of the programme's implementation. Yet all we get from Peter Garrett and Tim Mander are the same old lines about how popular it is with schools and parents.
ReplyDeleteWhat's going on here? Why is such a poorly designed and managed scheme so popular? Particularly if it puts children at risk.
http://www.ombudsman.gov.au/files/commonwealth_ombudsman_chaplaincy_report_06_11.pdf
Just some thoughts... has a really good point about one thing, has anyone asked the children? Well how about I ask my student who was "outed" as a lesbian if the support and counselling she received was helpful? Based on this same student, I can assure people that an internet forum support group is of more use than a chaplain. Why can't we just feed these people to the lions?
ReplyDeleteThis came to me via email from an educator who wants to remain annoymous:
ReplyDeleteDear “ Just Some Thoughts”,
I think your Evangelicals are showing...
”I am thinking about becoming one and am about to complete a BEd, and will then do a chaplaincy course. So 5 years training with kids”
Why would you do five years training and get a teaching qualification to then become a chaplain (which doesn't involve teaching?)...
”I intend to be part of extra-curricular activities and PDs, and will let kids know about the local church and youth group IF they ask.”
Ah, I see. Now you’re just scaring me.
”The chaplain at my school was fantastic. Kids who were bullied went to her (and later it was a guy) room as refuge during lunch times”
Hmm.. I'm not sure this is a very objective measure of your chaplain’s effectiveness? We have a place in our school called a library -- students can actually go there to read -- you know, books other than the Bible and religious propaganda. By the way -- students that are being bullied, will be followed up in our school by senior staff, and any support would be provided by our School Psychologist.
“but how much would they know about whether kids visit the chaplain during break times, or even during school time when their absence is unexplained?”
As you are about to complete five years of B Ed - let me explain to you a little thing called DUTY OF CARE.Teachers have to know where students are, during any time on school property.
” We are a Christian country”. Ah , no, no we’re not.
“....you WILL see schools and kids suffer if they are removed.”
HOW? They weren't even there are a few of years ago. but somehow, they are now "the glue that holds the school together" -- according to Scripture Union and Access Ministries
“Kids went to the guidance counsellor rarely, and usually for career guidance. When they wanted support, they went to the chaplain whose door remained OPEN.”
(By the way -- I'm not sure where you're from, but I don't know any guidance counsellor/school psychologist in Australia that spends much time - if any doing career guidance -- you may be thinking of America? This is nonsense. Maybe the door was closed because psychologists actually have to do this little thing called “confidentiality”, what with being a registered health professional and all, with a legally enforceable code of ethics.)
“But I think chaplains are different and the rules surrounding them mean that they can actually be of more support to kids than guidance counsellors because of red tape and legalistic rules.”
Yes, that's it -- just keep denigrating anyone with professional training -- and heck, we would want any sort of legalistic rules around people who have access to our children would we?
You are really frightening me. You put your foot in it, and I think you're about up to your knee by now.....
However, the coup de grace - at the end of the paragraph that started out with "just so you understand that I am not a religious nut", we have this:
“I guess that's hard to understand if you don't believe in God, but the power of prayer and having a chaplain at the school shouldn't be underestimated in its ability to protect and bless your kids.”
Please stay away from my children, Please stay out of our government schools. Please stop wasting our taxpayers money on this insidious evil.
There is a mental health crisis out there, and our young people need real help from trained professionals, who know what they're doing.
I'm shocked that this school has a "Chaplaincy Centre". What's happening to the public education system?
ReplyDeleteJust Some Thoughts is exactly why we need to keep our SECULAR schools SECULAR. I thank the blog owner for allowing his post to be there in black and white for all. A perfect example of its insidious nature.
ReplyDeleteIf parents wish for their kids to be indoctrinated into their faith from a young age then we have an entire Private schooling based sector for that. A few bucks a week is all it takes to get into most Catholic based schools per child and they can get all the religious guidance they'll ever need. The public school system should always remain secular. People choose to send their kids there to keep away from religious rubbish for a reason....and not have them wiggle their way in via a backdoor to do their recruiting.
Religions, especially our traditional christian institutions, are dying off slowly. The Chaplaincy program is what they have been hoping for to help boost their numbers and again try and throw their weight around in society as they once did. They've given up trying to recruit modern educated adults to concentrate on getting into the next generation before they finish their education aqnd know better.
All I can add are 2 quotes
ReplyDeleteQuote 1
I find the whole business of religion profoundly interesting. But it does mystify me that otherwise intelligent people take it seriously.
Quote 2
Isn't it enough to see that the garden is beautiful without having to believe that there are fairies at the bottom of it too?
Both are by Douglas Adam
Teaching stories to children may be entertaining but should not be taken seriously and treated as valid curriculum in state schools
Sylvia
When we can ridicule religion and humiliate its practitioners, then we can rid the world of this curse.
ReplyDeleteOnly by ridiculing religion and humiliating its practitioners can we rid the world of this curse.
ReplyDeleteOnly my opinion, not that it counts.
Another example of seriously backward Christian morality. If you truly cared for the welfare of children in state schools, you would want every available dollar spent on the highest possible quality care - trained professionals. Not on 'buddies' to hang out and play x-box with at lunchtime.
ReplyDeleteBeyond the millions of wasted tax dollars, there is also the hidden cost to regular school fundraising. It seems the chaplain at our school is having a different fundraiser every month, so that by the time the P&C comes around with their (slightly more humble) hat out, parents are already past their donation threshold. What are our kids missing out on so that the chaplain can hand out treats and buy games?
Get out of our schools and away from my kids.
Just some thoughts... said.."they can actually be of more support to kids than guidance counsellors because of red tape and legalistic rules" Those rules are there to protect kids.
ReplyDeleteIn 2008, a boy at a local State High School took his own life due to bullying at the school.
At the inquest into his death it was revealed that the boy told his school chaplain everything was 'cool' on the same day he took his own life.
The Chaplain, who had spent significant time with the boy, said he saw nothing to suggest Alex was being bullied.
This tragic story underlines the real problems with unqualified or underqualified people in a welfare position in schools.
The boy did not see the School Counsellor. The funding for the School Counsellor meant that she was at the school only 5 days a fortnight. Funding should be redirected from the Chaplains program to remedy this.
In his findings, the deputy State Coroner Malcolm MacPherson called for more Counsellors in schools. He did not call for more Chaplains.